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Messages - d3x0r

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General Discussion / School Mode
« on: November 01, 2019, 04:11:02 am »
Hello!  Great to see updates from y'all.

School shouldn't be tedious.... Right now, to get to be able to make your first tool... you have to dig, and I'm gussing it's 1.5 seconds(? 2?) per dig block?

( 64 * 3 = 192 ) * 1.5 = 382 seconds... 6 and a half minutes. (9 almost 10 minutes?)

And then I can find greenstone, and be able to return with it to the surface where my machine.

The document says.
'Where can you find it ?
You can find this voxel in the ground into the central blue flat zone.'  And the picture shows it on top of black rock blue... I know it's just showing the same block on the same oroginal blank stage, but... it does sort of imply that it can be over blackrrock blue - and it never is.

So ... I think " it's just another random block like copper, okay I'll keep digging sideways... surely they wouldn't force me to climb up and down all the time... " and dig t alot sideways, so now 30 minutes later and still no greenrock ...

Most voxelish digging games put rock only a little ways below dirt.... 4-8 voxels... because there's an infinite supply of dirt (blackrock blue).

So, optimally that's 6 minutes after the first 5-8 playing with the RTFM and external help; and having the cursor trapped to the game, so I can't click back on the browser... (tough, I know, to own the cursor, but give it up when you don't have it. )  There are lose focus events that you can revert the cursor capture... )

And if I was really new, I'd be sidetracked by copper and iron and other things, and it would really take me a long time to get to green rock; (I mentioned that earlier, it's realistically at LEAST 7 minutes, to make your first tool).

I wanted to learn to program, not spend my time in a clicker.

let me just reiterate, as i was closing this window... I missed the (X) a little...

1) when the game is not in focus, do not setmousepotiion on mouse event.  (background window of the browser, I miss the scroll bar a bit, and my mouse snaps to the other thing, but I was JUST typing in the browser... and then I have to get back to the scrollbar, but if there isn't actually another window over where the mosue moves, it's stuck, until you hit I to get to invenotry (free mouse) or something

2) alt-F4 doesn't work.

3) window isn't resizable by clicking on the frame (if you could somehow get the mouse off the game-focus :) )

So when drilling, if I click and drill, there's a kinda buzzing/grinding sound for the drill.  If I continue to hold the button, that sound stops for the second block.  if I release and click again it re-starts.  (almost shouldn't stop really?)

when holding shift (to run?) the footstep sound stops; and move speed doesn't seem different (if there's supposed to be one)

(Windows 7)

Announcements / Re: Blackvoxel V2.0 is out
« on: April 20, 2017, 10:48:09 am »
Yay! :)
Was just thinking... they said they were going to do a new version 'soon'... I checked a month or so ago and nothing :)  But now....

General Discussion / Re: Voxelarium.js
« on: October 28, 2016, 04:46:48 am »
I did some experimenting with building presorted voxels.... which seem to apply pretty fast.

This was part of the C# work; but basically I made a linear list of the closest points of sectors that are to the [upper/0/lower][left/0/right][forward/0/backward]

I just went through each point(voxel) and figured it's distance from the respective point, and then sorted the resulting indexes; so I could have an ordered list of voxel indexes for transparent things that are outside of 'here' which is the 0/0/0 center point...

And really to be more accurate any sector that is on a 0 needs to be sorted based on the slice of other coordinates... blah I'm over-complicating this.

For 'here' the sort list has to be dynamically computed; there's too many combinations to keep them all pre-set; well maybe sub-sectors could be made that could be pieced back together as 'close enough' ...

so anyway then it's just foreach( index in list ) { mesh voxel[index] based on drawinfo }   instead of just voxel based on offset... this will then add the faces to the draw list in the right order... (and maybe that's kinda what your sorter does; I just kinda wanted to implement it, because when I tried it with a bunch of semi transparent blocks it broke down because of how it serially stepped - without regard to which side the player was from the sector being meshed.

Why don't I get notifications? I end up having to just come back and read? I'm pretty sure I put in my email right?

General Discussion / Evolutionary voxel robots?
« on: October 28, 2016, 04:37:27 am »

I ran across this the other day; and you don't have an off topic, and really hope you don't find this too random :)

General Discussion / Re: Voxelarium.js
« on: October 12, 2016, 10:46:19 am »
I have some updates and news :)

I've been working on WebVR; and 3d controller support.  I have a single sector loaded that I can walk around, and that's kinda satisfying.

I don't really have pictures... and it's somewhat unstable.   I can't use my glow shaader in AltSpace VR (Free Social platform which supports all devices including 2d displays; err your desktop. )

I have it loading there which is almost like WebVR... but entirely not.

still actually working out controls; and I noticed in AltSpace that the controls are still hooked to their game engine, and I need to see if there's a can't default behavior;

and I had to fallback to conventional textures; but 90fps in javascript with lots of room to spare :) 

General Discussion / Re: Hello
« on: September 21, 2016, 04:08:56 am »
Really?  You're saying if I create a set of assets and charge $30 for them, that has anything at all to do with blackvoxel or it's code/resources? 

I disagree entirely.  If all supporting changes to the code is kept open source... but you can also charge for distribution of the sources, if no other methods are available... but even so...
The changes would have to be kept on your own git branch and basically any pull request would be useless to the mainline...

General Discussion / Re: Voxelarium.js
« on: June 05, 2016, 09:05:11 pm »
Need to dig out the how-to-find-face logic... I'm actually finding the cube reference so it replaces instead of adding...

updated demo page; first page takes a few seconds to load now.... could maybe have some optimizations.

the glow effect is bleeding through though... still need to figure out frame buffer targets with depth buffer.  I erased some cubes internally; a consequence of selecting a cube not a face :)   (going to fix that before updating the edit demo page (click 'editor' on first page)   

General Discussion / Re: Voxelarium.js
« on: June 01, 2016, 06:39:37 am »
Just posted for reference; going to start some smaller projects, next one's the editor.  I created like 50 lines with "some server name here"  "player 0/3"  "Ping 333"  and that meshed and rendered quickly.

I want to move away from flat GUI tech; because it's VR/3D unfriendly... and tinkering with that I guess I coudl just voxelize the words and move the camera up/down to get a list...

Need to work on inventory/hotbar stuff for editor... and then browsers don't really have localStorage either so some sort of server to save changed sectors....

I'll fix the demo name before all of that. Kinda soon...

three.js is a good inbetween; it handles meshes, computed min/max volume automatically and keeps objects in a scene so it can do full-sector sort of clipping; each object is one mesh; which is basically a few call lists (solid, transparent and custom) so that fits pretty good...  was even able to leverage some normal map effects etc on the texture in addition to glow... I render the face flat without glow, and render the edges to a glow buffer to apply a blur/extend of the bright edges.  I was trying to get very clever and render to a offscreen render target (like the glow is done), with a depth buffer, so I can clip the depth of the glow (without rendering the faces, the are transparent, so glow lines show up from the back... need to maybe just turn on one sided rendering too (kinda defaults to lazy mode)

Was thinking it might be a neat demo to do an old computer's boot (timex sinclair maybe?) that becomes like the intro level with the text as voxels on a background layer... maybe make it curved the the monitor :)  (probably wouldn't work out well)

Beyond that there's issues to tackle like WebAudio, and physics... Ammo.js is a port of bullet physics for instance (kinda overkill) there's another engine Cannon.js that's really popular, but its default objects are too.. squishy; they behave more like sponges than solid things... there's anther small engine (some 300k) called Oimo which has more rigidity; but also causes shapes to pop more on even small penetrations...   

Not expecting anything from anyone, just posting information; and I know noone does javascript;  Who would do Javascript?  that's a web script kiddy language!  Ya... well, it has evolved over 20 years and is actually more usable than java.   There's Node.JS which is a console-based runner for javascript; it's fairily easy to write hooks to create c++ objects from javascript using Node.JS modules you can just hook native code, which could include opening an SDL window and everything else that is Blackvoxel *shrug*  I wrote some modules that node.js could use to create frames using my library (SACK -

I also write a script language processor called dekware ( )  which was utterly simple; but conceptually can be refit to be native javascript and use javascript as the language with some extensions and instead of being some class of object itself.. I dunno I think I can get the object persistance to work in a distributed platform between multiple clusters of server nodes even but that's a entirely different project :)

General Discussion / Re: Voxelarium.js
« on: May 28, 2016, 12:17:00 pm »


for development Electron is used(required?), so require() works.  (
for building node is required, for browserify...  Browserify does have a -d option to make the output more debug friendly (and chome detects debug information)... (

and Atom for a javascript editor (works OK it's a little ... flaky)

General Discussion / Re: Voxelarium.js
« on: May 27, 2016, 10:43:11 am »

Dug a little and found TI-99/4a Font; nice 8x8 bitmap font from my first computer :)

Have meshing working; no culling; and can output strings in voxel clusters :)

General Discussion / Voxelarium.js
« on: May 24, 2016, 05:09:12 am »
I got tired of the C# port already :)  (never did finish actually implementing the game portion of it... just water)

Started a new javascript/three.js version...

click and drag; 's' enables moving scaling, it's not very good... faster than scroll wheel though

it's actually broken into separate files on the source side; fed through 'browserify' to make it simple to load on the web page.... but you can save the page and have all the sources; soon to make a github branch for it

(the mode buttons don't do anything any more; I also did a test ... )

(although it's more inspired by, and plajurizing a couple algorithms like sectorSphere :)

General Discussion / Re: Congratulations?
« on: April 22, 2016, 12:21:47 am »

Also on Steam, also GPL.... (well v2; did v3 add something about not charging money? )

General Discussion / Re: Dynamic fonts
« on: December 16, 2015, 02:35:12 am »
Dynamic fonts....
   well only a certain subset of characters is required for most games; if a translation to something like russian or an asian language happens, then none of the latin characters are required... and rather than saying 'for every possible character' it's not that much more 'work' to 'for each character Ii'm outputting, get the character information; and create if it doesn't exist'  You already have to do a 'for each character' loop to ooutput the texture uv's/coords of each character cell... so rather than a computation c%16, c / 16 + character sizes... I get back a struct that has the UV array already created for that source texture... (current character map is only like 23 characters... lots don't get rendered like 'q' 'Q' 'z' 'Z' ... but like 'O' and 'o' exist in 'Options' )

  Basically the update to the physics info happens during culling (if some face is drawn, needs a physical representation).   decided for now to not update transparent voxels (water) to physics... though maybe someday; would almost like to do a displacement model (if thing is in water, shove water out of the way) which depending on distances required to cause a 'shove' would provide a bouyancy... but I think that will have to be a wish... I'm only at 500k water voxels update in twice the time I had 2 million updates in blackvoxel engine itself.  (C# sucks :) the always-check-array-bounds is the overhead )

After a few fixes to sector recycling code I had ended up bypassing, did get it to run on my Android tablet :)

stepped away a bit to implement networking... but I need to implement a listbox control...

But it's progressing slowly.  Still basically non-functional though; Inventory doesn't display - complicated that by using a procedural shader for first 10 block types; was looking to making more procedural texture shaders for like metals (ingots) etc; but I don't see how they are done... Implemented a BitStream class to compress sectors (basically RLE; but also scan the sector for all voxel types used, and build a dictionary, then use that count to get the number of bits required; and store counts/voxel types with that number of bits... (like most sectors by default use 8 or fewer block types... even at 16 types the voxel storage is then 1/4 the default type)

Still missing sound support... list goes oh :)

General Discussion / Re: Dynamic fonts
« on: November 22, 2015, 08:30:14 pm »
Hi d3x0r,

That's a great job you are doing here. And we are really proud to see you are using Blackvoxel as a base for your game. :)

Maybe the start of a great adventure for you.

The choice of C# is slightly surprising to me  :o. But why not if you like it... so I'm just curious to know why you choose this language.

Why not a C# robot. I'm not a C# expert at all, but that could be interesting to add one in Blackvoxel. Our long term goal is to add many languages. (The problem will be how to make it in a "clean" way).
The choice was primarily that C# comes with the compiler itself so it can build itself.  If you install C# you install the compiler.  It's certainly not without penalties though... like without resorting to 'unsafe' code you can't use pointers to walk arrays, and every access to an array is bounds checked against the instanced array boundaries.  In C# 'struct' is actually a different behavior from 'class' in that struct is a value type like int or float, where classes are always reference types.  So primitives like vectors are good as struct types, but you can't keep a reference to a struct; you can pass a reference to a struct to a function, but can't say 'use that struct over there for this'.  *shrug*

Adding an interop module could have been done; but not without huge expense.  It's not so easy for MS C# and would have to be done with Mono, which is quite a download; but seems to work pretty well for Unity.

I see you have mentionned that your work is derived from blackvoxel, that is right.
I know your code is at a preliminary state, but there is something very important you must add in your code ;). As a derived work of a GNU GPL v3 software, you must mention the GPLv3 licence AND original copyrights, both on a Copyright/License files and in the headers of the source code. (GPL V3 Licence).
That's not only for legal reason about the Blackvoxel license, but also for the guys crawling on your github : Even if your game is only in source form at this time, someone could go into your github and take code or assets without knowing licencing conditions. Imagine someone make proprietary software with it or simply use this code without mentionning copyright, they can and end up with troubles with us (Blackvoxel code was legaly registered in order to protect the licence).
Third party libraries should also be listed with their copyrights, authors and licencing conditions. Cross compatibility legal issues should be avoided.
Above legal reason, that's important for authors and contributors to be listed : that could help some to find a job.
I understand (as I remember that by the past, you said) you are not aware of all theses picky legal stuff . But we have worked a lot (and unfortunately spent a lot of time) about these legal details in order to avoid problems.
But, don't worry, we can help you and explain what must be done and even help you to write some of these "legal stuff" files for you.

That could also be interesting for you to know why we made the choice of free software. And why we choose the particular GPL V3+ licence that is a free licence, but somewhat restrictive in some way compared to MIT or BSD like licences : In few words, a software derived from a GPL v3+ free software must be a GPL v3+ free software without exception. That's a way to protect the work for free software programmers : Everybody can use the code freely and make their stuff with it, but in return, they must do the same. Of course, licencing terms have heavy consequences depending on your goals.
I'll spend some time today updating sources; in the process of the porting I created original files and copied header/source file contents as appropriate.  (Actually make that past-tense.)  I have no issue propagating GNU GPLv3 to this :)

About the font class, that's an interesting developpment. As you know, in Blackvoxel, we made a particular design choice with "8 bit computer style fixed font" kind of text. But as you know the font rendering system is made only for this particular case. The static rendering way of vector font is a good choice. No need for dynamic one that would be... slower.  :)
Yes I know all about the 'style choices' :)  I just figured I'd mention it as it was a small source addition (some 3000 lines) and not a lot of work to implement; though does remove stylized look; and ends up making rather fuzzy characters when blown up large.  Looks nice in small cases.... will have to provide a couple different renderings in the future for things like the large text on the main menu.... a slowdown of only a tiny fraction of a percent in the grand scheme; except the one-time hit to render to the texture when a character doesn't exist.  *shrug*  It still fits within the idle time of a frame at 60fps... 

Even if ores aren't un-minable by hand in Blackvoxel, the required quantities to make an airplane are very important for simple hand mining. But I'm not completely sure that every players understand that. In the future, there will be more in-game tutorial and missions to help player to understand what are the best ways. Blackvoxel is a long term project and there is a lot of things remaining to do.
Actually; ores don't last 'forever' but instead are consumed over time, apparently removing the furthest block of ore attached to a seam until it's all gone.  I hadn't played long enough to exhaust an ore until yesterday... then I had to move my coal and tin drills to another vein.

Yea; I didn't actually make it to genuinely making a plane, and instead ended up enabling creative mode and just created one :)

About physics engines, I can't say what is the best depending on what you want to do. Including vector entities or making multi-grids interactions might mean different approachs. In Blackvoxel, the choice of an unique grid and "pure voxel" interactions is a strong choice. But we understand that someone wanting to make a different game could want some different choices. The two library you mentioned are free and have compatible licence.

The ability to well sandbox code in C# is interesting. C# is a fast and efficient language compared to little scripting ones. Of course, not as fast as C/C++, but C/C++ is unsuitable for doing sandboxed parts(unless wanting to play with heavy hardware processor sandboxing stuff...).

The Blackvoxel Team
Actually javascript is all the craze now; the Chome V8 javascript engine actually emits native instructions and is very fast; amazingly so given the generic-ness of javascript.

Medieval/Space Engineers is C# entirely; they use Havok as a physics engine.

I've seen quite a few C# games coming out so I guess it is a viable platform for rather large spaces.  I'm still iffy on this whole garbage collection thing and would much rather release/delete things in a controlled manner.
I'm using OpenTK as the graphics interface layer (which provides OpenGL and sound in theory)  But I have yet to have any sounds ported.

BEPU has a voxel physics demo - it is the engine for Lemma  which is another voxel based game.  The demo source includes creating a custom voxel collision shape handler; basically it's a large array of bools instead of building actual box shapes and stuffing them into a compound object.  Will be interesting :) 

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